davinci1490
Posts: 5
Joined: Tue Jun 12, 2018 3:32 pm

Leasing new 2018 model vs buying 2016 model

Tue Jun 12, 2018 3:41 pm

Hi all, I am new here but I am not new to EV cars.
My previous car was 2012 leaf. Bought used in 2015 for 14000, paid it off. Now the battery is less than 50 miles at full charge. It was such a waste of money. And now the car is worth less than 4000.
With that in mind, I am debating if I should get a used 2016 i3 around 20,000 or just go with lease a 2018. If it would end up like i3 in 3 years, then I would be wasting all the money on paying car loan again.
So my question is that is it worth to buy a used i3? how much could they be worth in 2020?

Any advice on this would be highly appreciated!

viking79
Posts: 91
Joined: Wed Apr 16, 2014 3:04 pm

Re: Leasing new 2018 model vs buying 2016 model

Tue Jun 12, 2018 5:20 pm

Your leaf depreciation is pretty typical of any car, maybe a little steeper. Especially if you paid near KBB Retail Price in 2015. Is $4k the trade in? Private party is more like $6,500? It is just how these cars are.

If you buy an i3 BEV it will see similarly bad depreciation as its range will also be outclassed by new cars in 2020 for less money than now. The i3 Rex will always be worth a premium due to ability to drive long distance on gas for when battery degrades out of warranty.

However, has your leaf dropped range enough to get the battery exchanged under warranty?

jadnashuanh
Posts: 3986
Joined: Thu May 22, 2014 2:07 pm
Location: Nashua, NH USA

Re: Leasing new 2018 model vs buying 2016 model

Tue Jun 12, 2018 6:09 pm

Nissan had and still has probably the least sophisticated battery temperature (and therefore life) management of any of the more popular EVs out there...it is essentially air cooled where most of the others from bit manufacturers are liquid cooled and heated (generally via electric). A Leaf in say Phoenix probably wouldn't keep much range on its battery. Even their newest one, if I read the review properly, says that you can only do ONE high voltage DC charge during a trip, or you have to wait hours for things to cool off.

The i3 has an 8-year warranty on the battery that states it will retain AT LEAST 70% of the original capacity within 8-years, or it will be replaced under warranty. It's almost like you're talking apples and oranges. The i3 can actually get out of its own way, too.
Jim DeBruycker
2011 535i x-drive GT, 2014 i3 BEV

davinci1490
Posts: 5
Joined: Tue Jun 12, 2018 3:32 pm

Re: Leasing new 2018 model vs buying 2016 model

Wed Jun 13, 2018 9:32 pm

viking79 wrote:Your leaf depreciation is pretty typical of any car, maybe a little steeper. Especially if you paid near KBB Retail Price in 2015. Is $4k the trade in? Private party is more like $6,500? It is just how these cars are.

If you buy an i3 BEV it will see similarly bad depreciation as its range will also be outclassed by new cars in 2020 for less money than now. The i3 Rex will always be worth a premium due to ability to drive long distance on gas for when battery degrades out of warranty.

However, has your leaf dropped range enough to get the battery exchanged under warranty?



That is a very good point about the REX. I am not a fan of the idea about having gas but what you said is a key point that i need to consider.

My leaf still has 9 bars for the capacity so unfortunately it is not quality for exchange under warranty :(((

davinci1490
Posts: 5
Joined: Tue Jun 12, 2018 3:32 pm

Re: Leasing new 2018 model vs buying 2016 model

Wed Jun 13, 2018 9:37 pm

jadnashuanh wrote:Nissan had and still has probably the least sophisticated battery temperature (and therefore life) management of any of the more popular EVs out there...it is essentially air cooled where most of the others from bit manufacturers are liquid cooled and heated (generally via electric). A Leaf in say Phoenix probably wouldn't keep much range on its battery. Even their newest one, if I read the review properly, says that you can only do ONE high voltage DC charge during a trip, or you have to wait hours for things to cool off.

The i3 has an 8-year warranty on the battery that states it will retain AT LEAST 70% of the original capacity within 8-years, or it will be replaced under warranty. It's almost like you're talking apples and oranges. The i3 can actually get out of its own way, too.



wow 8 year is a lot Well does it mean that it would be better to buy a 2016 not 2015 then? it could be 2000-3000 cheaper for a 2015 model. I am not sure if the extra one year warranty would worth that much money.

Thanks!

BMW4Me
Posts: 84
Joined: Fri Jun 13, 2014 8:50 pm
Location: Washington, DC

Re: Leasing new 2018 model vs buying 2016 model

Fri Jun 15, 2018 1:26 pm

I would not recommend getting the i3 without the updated battery pack from 2017. I owned a 2014 i3 and I was constantly needing to charge. In the cold winter I didn't even know if I'd have 50 miles of range or less! Get the latest battery and you'll be driving much more between charges!

johnnylingo
Posts: 82
Joined: Mon Nov 09, 2015 11:26 pm
Location: Santa Cruz, CA

Re: Leasing new 2018 model vs buying 2016 model

Sat Jun 16, 2018 9:06 pm

There's no fundamental difference between the 2015 and 2016 models. IMO, either way, you'll find yourself craving longer range and I'd go with the cheaper 2015. The depreciation on them seems to have leveled out and even if you only keep it for a year, you don't be out all that much money.

But if you're OK with a $400/mo zero down lease payment, I'd go with a 2018. Everyone's range situation is different but for me having 100+ miles with the REx as backup is a game-changer as I can go all around the Bay Area in a single day with only one charging stop.
2018 i3s REx / Mineral Gray / Giga / Tech Pkg / Parking / HK Speakers / Moonroof bought 6-12-2018 * ChargePoint Home 32a (Hardwired)

EVMan
Posts: 177
Joined: Sat Feb 25, 2017 4:31 pm
Location: USA, CA

Re: Leasing new 2018 model vs buying 2016 model

Sat Jun 16, 2018 9:42 pm

davinci1490 wrote:Hi all, I am new here but I am not new to EV cars.
My previous car was 2012 leaf. Bought used in 2015 for 14000, paid it off. Now the battery is less than 50 miles at full charge. It was such a waste of money. And now the car is worth less than 4000.
With that in mind, I am debating if I should get a used 2016 i3 around 20,000 or just go with lease a 2018. If it would end up like i3 in 3 years, then I would be wasting all the money on paying car loan again.
So my question is that is it worth to buy a used i3? how much could they be worth in 2020?

Any advice on this would be highly appreciated!


I would definitely consider a used one at the correct price , but i feel the 20K needs to come down further for sure for the i3.
There are some hidden costs with lease as well, like insurance costs for new car and if you have minor accidents.
2016 22KWH Rex ( Lease to Return ) ~ Model 3 Dual Motor, Long Range ( Wait-listed )
2017 33KWH Rex
Solar ToU Plan

sipabit
Posts: 75
Joined: Sun Mar 04, 2018 2:01 am

Re: Leasing new 2018 model vs buying 2016 model

Mon Jul 23, 2018 10:37 pm

davinci1490 wrote:Hi all, I am new here but I am not new to EV cars.
My previous car was 2012 leaf. Bought used in 2015 for 14000, paid it off. Now the battery is less than 50 miles at full charge. It was such a waste of money. And now the car is worth less than 4000.
With that in mind, I am debating if I should get a used 2016 i3 around 20,000 or just go with lease a 2018. If it would end up like i3 in 3 years, then I would be wasting all the money on paying car loan again.
So my question is that is it worth to buy a used i3? how much could they be worth in 2020?

Any advice on this would be highly appreciated!


1. The original generation Leaf had old technology. It was first to the race but was out dated quickly as the competition came on board. There's no reason for concern of having the same experience repeated on a different car. Battery technology is vastly different.
2. We are in a very unique situation with why the used 2015 i3's are priced the way they are and we may not see all the stars align again to give us this opportunity to pick one up. I consider the 2015 i3 the best value used EV of 2018. I've elaborated on that in different threads. Don't want to throw off the topic here. if your'e getting a used one, the best value will be a 2015. I only got the 2016 b/c I wanted the limited edition interior of the Value package that was only made from April to June of 2016. There's little other reason to get the 2016 over the 2015 which is priced a lot better. These cars are typically second vehicles for most previous owners which is the reason that anything more than 20k miles on a 2015 is considered high. The 2016 still has the smaller battery. As far as buying a 2016 (even though I wouldn't recommend that as a I stated) vs leasing a 2018, it really depends on how long you plan to keep the car. If I'm reading you right, you're in for a deal and tempted to buy one buy am just worried about deja vu of reliving the poor experience you had and for that reason (and maybe the only reason) considering leasing a current model. If that's the case, then it's literally a matter of how long you plan to keep the car.

If you plan to keep the car for only the duration of a lease, then do that. If you plan to keep it longer, then I'd buy. Again, we're in a unique situation with the i3 pricing the way it is. You should take advantage of it if you find that it works for you. The car isn't for everyone, but it's for more people than who will admit.
A fanatic of all things electric. Ridables like electric ice chests and stand up scooters I adore. Drones like DJI, I root for. I'm a fan of both, but nothing beats my love for my 2016 i3 Rex with Deka World. Shhh, don't tell my wife.

jadnashuanh
Posts: 3986
Joined: Thu May 22, 2014 2:07 pm
Location: Nashua, NH USA

Re: Leasing new 2018 model vs buying 2016 model

Tue Jul 24, 2018 12:42 am

I bought my 2014 right after they became available. WOrks fine. It only has about 13K miles on it, when I get home, it gets plugged in, and sits there. The estimated range is still in the 80-mile range. It was cooler a couple of days ago, the car said 69-miles when I got in then I drove 14-miles, and it said 71...the estimation is not always correct, but you get a feel for it and where you'll be driving after awhile. Normally, I don't need more than about 35-40 miles. If I'm going to be going much further, I take my ICE. I might stretch it out to an anticipated 70-miles if it won't be high speed highway miles. It's not let me down yet. Drives like new, looks like new, expect it to last a number of additional years, so I am not worrying about depreciation. If it continues along as it has, I could own this thing for more than 10-years. I don't NEED a bigger battery. By then, there will be lots of options, but unless it starts to give me grief on service issues, I'll just keep it. If it were a REx, the additional maintenance and complexity, I'd probably have not bought it and opted for a different hybrid.

Seriously consider how much range you need and how often, plus, if you have an alternative. That can make the decision on a BEV verses the REx easier. I opted for the more efficient, lighter, simpler BEV, but your needs may differ both functionally and financially. Adding 10% more to the vehicle weight has it's detrimental effects if you don't need it.
Jim DeBruycker
2011 535i x-drive GT, 2014 i3 BEV

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