i3 BEV vs. REx from owner of both

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WaffleHouse

Member
Joined
Jan 23, 2014
Messages
23
I spend about 50% of my time in Europe and the other half in the USA. After purchasing the BEV in Europe a couple of months ago and loving my i3, I took the plunge last week and purchased another i3 in the USA, except this time I purchased the REx.

The first very noticeable difference I felt between the two models was the pickup; I notice a *significant* difference in the acceleration. The BEV seems to 'fly' when I hit the accelerator pedal all the way; that feeling is absolutely not the same with the REx. Based on the 0-60 speed numbers I have read on each, you'd think the difference between the two models would be almost imperceptible, but let me assure you, that is not the case. Don't get me wrong, the REx still has fantastic acceleration, but it is definitely more 'sluggish' (if you can call it that) than the BEV.

With that said, even though I don't usualy drive long distances in either continent, the REx gives me a priceless piece of mind. I feel far more comfortable not having to worry about the very limited mileage of the BEV. The REx 'insurance' was definitely worth the price to me; it enables me to enjoy my car more, giving me that feeling of freedom and knowing that I've cut that 'umbilical cord'. I now wish I had purchased the REx unit in Europe as well. I see how it would be possible for others to also regret their BEV over REx decision, but I can't picture the opposite: drivers thinking down the road 'Oh why, why on earth did I get the REx?! (when I rarely use it)".

I know everyone's circumstances are different, but with that said, I just wanted to give the forum a summary of *my* experience.
 
Thanks for this. I had an extended test drive of the aRex prior to ordering and was really impressed with the acceleration. I can't imagine an even faster one :eek:
 
WaffleHouse said:
I see how it would be possible for others to also regret their BEV over REx decision, but I can't picture the opposite: drivers thinking down the road 'Oh why, why on earth did I get the REx?! (when I rarely use it)".
A couple of thoughts to help your vision, if only so very slightly. For a rarely if ever used, and never really needed REX, the REX owner has a significant cost tied up in the purchase price which will see depreciation, has higher maintenance costs (after warranty) if only for oil changes with no break downs, has increased operating costs due to reduced electrical efficiency from greater weight and lack of heat pump, has higher annual registration fees because it is not pure EV (at least in Arizona), has to deal with a more complex instrument panel with only added confusion and no added useful information with similar complexity on the mobile apps, and, of course, has to continuously deal with the ever-present flap of shame that so terribly mars an otherwise beautiful car! :mrgreen:
 
A couple of thoughts to help your vision...
There speaks a purist! (And how many is "a couple"? :p)
But I respect and value the observations of someone who has experience of both. Plus, the European Rex is a much better option than the US, because you can choose when you use it from 75% discharged instead of only below 6%. Because the UK charging infrastructure is so poorly developed as yet, I would not have bought an i3 at all if it had been a US-style Rex version. It might be a different story in a couple of years time, but for now, I'm content with having chosen the Rex.
 
I decided on a BEV for a few reasons. Owning a Volt a couple of years now, I discovered I had never paid any attention to my daily driving miles. There really was not need to. Since I started to pay attention, I've found that in my personal driving situation, I can do 100% of my daily commuting without having to use the Volt's REX. That's with just 40 EV miles available in a Volt! Lifetime, I've done almost 28K and just 32% of those miles have been using the REX. With at least twice the EV driving range of my Volt, I have no doubt the i3 BEV will meet my daily driving needs.

I also considered these factors:
  • - My average daily use over the last 2 years is 33.5 mi
  • - Charging infrastructure in my area is good and getting better. 90% of the time I charge at home anyway
  • - It cost less. Why pay for something I don't need
  • - HOV lane access is unrestricted for BEVs (CA White Sticker)
  • - Better performance
  • - I have another car when needed

So for you folks who are trying to decide what version will work for you, I suggest you consider these factors to help make your decision. Thanks for your insights ..
 
i3Alan said:
For a rarely if ever used, and never really needed REX, the REX owner has a significant cost tied up in the purchase price which will see depreciation, has higher maintenance costs (after warranty) if only for oil changes with no break downs, has increased operating costs due to reduced electrical efficiency from greater weight and lack of heat pump, has higher annual registration fees because it is not pure EV (at least in Arizona), has to deal with a more complex instrument panel with only added confusion and no added useful information with similar complexity on the mobile apps...
While the BEV is a great solution for folks like Zzzoom3 who will never have a need to exceed its range, and therefore do not need to own another vehicle for longer trips, there are probably more that do. For those folks (to use your words):

For a rarely if ever used separate ICE vehicle, the REx and ICE owner has significant cost tied up in the purchase price which will see depreciation, has higher maintenance costs (after warranty) if only for oil changes with no break downs, has immensely increased operating costs due to the cost of gasoline, and has higher annual registration fees because it is a completely separate vehicle.

That separate vehicle is a far more costly and complex proposition than a simple range extending engine/generator system.

i3Alan said:
...and, of course, has to continuously deal with the ever-present flap of shame that so terribly mars an otherwise beautiful car! :mrgreen:
Or carry the REx proudly as a badge of honor, announcing to the world that they get it. They place a higher priority on driving electric miles than they do on some flawed concept of "purity". An often overlooked reality of the REx is that it will always give you the capability to drive more electric miles than the combination of a BEV and an ICE.

Consider a 100 mile drive under conditions that will only allow for 72 miles of electric range. A REx will make that drive 72% electric / 28% gas. The BEV/ICE combination will make that drive 0% electric / 100% gas.

For a great many people, the REx is a more "pure" EV than the often touted BEV/ICE combination.
 
LOL..... I knew this thread would most likely turn into a "religion" type thread...which is fine.

I myself am one of the "BEV" followers. I absolutely love the significant additional performance (yes, I have driven both), and simplicity of not carrying around the ICE overhead (CEL anyone?). 95% of how I drive easily fits within BEV parameters (no charging necessary except at home), and when it doesn't, I have a '11 Z4 sDrive 3.5i, and a '14 Chevy Silverado p/u for the other 5%. Not too mention we generate over 60% of our daily household power from solar/wind, so it costs very little to power.
 
i3Alan said:
WaffleHouse said:
I see how it would be possible for others to also regret their BEV over REx decision, but I can't picture the opposite: drivers thinking down the road 'Oh why, why on earth did I get the REx?! (when I rarely use it)".
A couple of thoughts to help your vision, if only so very slightly. For a rarely if ever used, and never really needed REX, the REX owner has a significant cost tied up in the purchase price which will see depreciation, has higher maintenance costs (after warranty) if only for oil changes with no break downs, has increased operating costs due to reduced electrical efficiency from greater weight and lack of heat pump, has higher annual registration fees because it is not pure EV (at least in Arizona), has to deal with a more complex instrument panel with only added confusion and no added useful information with similar complexity on the mobile apps, and, of course, has to continuously deal with the ever-present flap of shame that so terribly mars an otherwise beautiful car! :mrgreen:

Well that's your call, I got the Rex and do not regret it. In fact I think resell value of the rex will more than offset the cost, because as the battery pack range deteriorates :mrgreen: the Rex range won't!
 
i3Alan said:
A couple of thoughts to help your vision, if only so very slightly. For a rarely if ever used, and never really needed REX, the REX owner has a significant cost tied up in the purchase price which will see depreciation, has higher maintenance costs (after warranty) if only for oil changes with no break downs, has increased operating costs due to reduced electrical efficiency from greater weight and lack of heat pump, has higher annual registration fees because it is not pure EV (at least in Arizona), has to deal with a more complex instrument panel with only added confusion and no added useful information with similar complexity on the mobile apps, and, of course, has to continuously deal with the ever-present flap of shame that so terribly mars an otherwise beautiful car! :mrgreen:
Deary me. That just sounds like you're trying to come up with reasons to persuade yourself that it's ok that you've made a mistake about which one you've bought :p
 
Though we are a multi-car family I don’t like switching cars. I develop a monogamous relationship with my car. So I opted for an i3 REX so I wouldn’t have to drive a different car on those occasions I need to go further than 70 miles or so. I do appreciate that BMW used just about the minimum practical ICE. How many other “hybrids” have an electric motor so much more powerful than the ICE?

I do admit I feel a little shame at having an ICE in my electric car. When I tell people I have a new electric car I feel required to add, “Well, mostly electric.”

In the religious analogy I suppose I am a sinner who's trying to improve. But don't throw the first stone unless you are entirely free of the sin of petroleum in all the vehicles you use.
 
ultraturtle said:
While the BEV is a great solution for folks like Zzzoom3 who will never have a need to exceed its range, and therefore do not need to own another vehicle for longer trips, there are probably more that do. For those folks (to use your words): ...
I was just answering the original question, why someone might wish they had purchased the BEV instead of the REX. There was no claim whatsoever that it would apply to all or most, or even more than me and Zzzoom3.

Personally, we love to do long road trips, and our Lexus ES hybrid is the perfect car for us to handle that need. We also need two cars, but two EVs, even if was was a REX, could not handle MOST of our miles driven, unless you think >1000 mile trips for two to four adults and one or two dogs, including suitcases, in various almost random directions, is easily doable in a REX. Our ES will see lots of miles that could easily be handled by a BEV (because the i3 is concurrently being use), and there will be the very rare trip that the ES will be needed that could have been easily handled by a REX, but not by our BEV. Except for the flap of shame, which was only listed as a joke (and so annotated), the other reasons I listed do apply to us.
 
I tend to keep my cars for a fairly long time, so depreciation, where you take the biggest hit in the first couple of years, isn't really a big issue. The vast majority of my driving is around town - to the grocery store, shopping, to the bike trail, or for a doctor's appointment, or visit friends. All of those are easily within the range of the BEV. My 'other' car is paid for, and the insurance of a second vehicle wasn't all that dear. I could not use either the BEV or REx on some of the trips I do take, so I'd either have to rent a vehicle or keep the one that I have that is already paid for, so I chose to keep it. I like the fact that the BEV has essentially no mileage related maintenance required - essentially only change the cabin air filters and flush the brake fluid at 2-years. And, it's faster and more efficient than the REx.

The REx may be a viable choice for some people, but unless you make some very long stops along the way, on the REx, after the batteries are down where you must run the REx, ALL of your further miles are supported by the REx at in the order of 40mpg, with a stop probably at least every hour and maybe more often, depending on the spacing of available fuel stations. As a result, on a longer trip, not counting the luggage space, it's not that great. I can easily carry four people and lots of luggage and get over 30mpg on my other car, and not stop for 500-miles unless I wish to. Something that gives great flexibility that the i3 will likely never have. But, it's lousy at short distance hops to the store, and that is where the i3 shines.
 
kevinb61 said:
LOL..... I knew this thread would most likely turn into a "religion" type thread...which is fine.
Yes, there is going to be a lot of that for sure. I sort of enjoy it as long as people stay civil and don't attack each other. Let's hope :|
 
KurtEndress said:
I do admit I feel a little shame at having an ICE in my electric car. When I tell people I have a new electric car I feel required to add, “Well, mostly electric.”
Ahh don't say that. We are all doing a good thing driving electric. I'm no environmentalist but it's a tremendous cumulative savings in emissions and petrol based fuel usage REX or BEV. In my case alone, over the last 2 yrs, 3 months I've saved about 30 gal per month; 815 gal lifetime (see link for graphic).


I don't think the author started this thread so we could argue which version was better. Both versions are good. Each of us has different requirements/needs.
 
ultraturtle said:
Consider a 100 mile drive under conditions that will only allow for 72 miles of electric range. A REx will make that drive 72% electric / 28% gas. The BEV/ICE combination will make that drive 0% electric / 100% gas.
For a great many people, the REx is a more "pure" EV than the often touted BEV/ICE combination.

This is being rather artistic and a stretch even for you, ultraturtle.. :)

The "pure" choice is the BEV. BMW wanted to create an electric car. BMW admitted something to the effect that the REx was done to placate fears of range anxiety, effectively admitting that the BEV is the car BMW wanted to build.

Also, don't forget the reduced range electric of the REx. In your analysis above you assumed the range is the same.

Also, the REx does NOT replace a traditional ICE car. So comparing the ~$4K additional cost of the REx to the cost of owning a 2nd car doesn't work. Why? Because you cannot reliably and efficiently drive it long distance.

If you can stomach it, the BEV is the one to get, especially in North America.

The added (marginal) range of the REx is really only psychological insurance for most… unless you routinely drive 100-200km (but not more than that), in a day.
 
You stated 'The added (marginal) range of the REx is really only psychological insurance for most… unless you routinely drive 100-200km (but not more than that), in a day.’ Wrong.

We know from other posters that you can use the REX for much longer if you want. Personally, I prefer the flexibility that the REX offers and have no interest in the ‘purist’ lobby.
 
MikeS said:
You stated 'The added (marginal) range of the REx is really only psychological insurance for most… unless you routinely drive 100-200km (but not more than that), in a day.’ Wrong.

We know from other posters that you can use the REX for much longer if you want. Personally, I prefer the flexibility that the REX offers and have no interest in the ‘purist’ lobby.

LOL...'purist lobby'...... Now we are moving from religion to politics....good stuff. Amazing how people get so sensitive when people have different wants/needs for a product.
 
MikeS said:
You stated 'The added (marginal) range of the REx is really only psychological insurance for most… unless you routinely drive 100-200km (but not more than that), in a day.’ Wrong.

We know from other posters that you can use the REX for much longer if you want. Personally, I prefer the flexibility that the REX offers and have no interest in the ‘purist’ lobby.
While, yes, you can drive the REx as far as you want, refilling the fuel tank probably at least once an hour, it is not the same as an ICE, never will be. With an ICE, you have full functional capacity until the last drop of fuel is used and the range between refueling stops can be significant - even the worst performing ICE can go further than an i3 REx before it runs out of fuel, and many can go many hundreds of miles (I can get over 500-miles on my ICE between fillups). If you want to stretch the operation of the i3, either REx or BEV, you need to make compromises either in top speed, creature comforts, or both. Not so with an ICE (well, top speed is a fuel discriminator, but my ICE can still go at its max - 155mph, further than the i3 REX, and climb hills and keep the seat heaters and whatever running full tilt until it runs out - a REx, even if you keep filling the fuel tank, depending on where and how you are driving, may be in the 'reserve' condition of the batteries with compromised performance at least part of that time).

Yes, there are people that will be able to use the i3Rex as their only car, and yes, running around town at the normal distance commute is far more economical than a typical ICE, but throw in that long drive and it becomes a significant compromise. If you're willing to accept that, fine. I use my BEV where it shines, and my ICE when it wouldn't or couldn't. I had no good reason to want the REx to add a buffer to my trips. I generally know where I'm going to be going on any particular day, and choose my vehicle accordingly.
 
MikeS said:
Yes, there are people that will be able to use the i3Rex as their only car, and yes, running around town at the normal distance commute is far more economical than a typical ICE, but throw in that long drive and it becomes a significant compromise. If you're willing to accept that, fine. I use my BEV where it shines, and my ICE when it wouldn't or couldn't. I had no good reason to want the REx to add a buffer to my trips. I generally know where I'm going to be going on any particular day, and choose my vehicle accordingly.

+1 to this. Amen brother (hehehe...ok..so back to religion!)

Also, I didn't realize (I never priced it) that the REX option is $4k. Wow. That's a lot for a scooter motor (saw that somewhere else on this forum, may or may not be correct) and 2 gal gas tank.
(Disclaimer: That is just MY opinion.....your mileage :roll: may vary!)
 
MikeS said:
You stated 'The added (marginal) range of the REx is really only psychological insurance for most… unless you routinely drive 100-200km (but not more than that), in a day.’ Wrong.

We know from other posters that you can use the REX for much longer if you want. Personally, I prefer the flexibility that the REX offers and have no interest in the ‘purist’ lobby.
I was wondering how long it was going to take to "heat up" this thread!

Personally, as I tried to convey here and in other threads, it's a personal decision. There is no right or wrong better or worse in this. From my own experience, those who have never owned an EV (REx or BEV), don't yet really understand how the range limitations affect them and this is why it is called "range anxiety". I know because, 2 years ago, there is no way I would have bought a Leaf or i3 BEV. A REX car is all I would consider for all the same reasons the i3 REX folks here have stated.

Today, not the same story for the reasons I alluded too above. After you've had one for a while, there will no longer be any "anxiety" because you will know exactly what works and doesn't work REX or BEV.

So ultimately, it is a good decision for some folks and it sells more cars for the manufacturer. BMW figured that out and added the option.
 
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