Any i3 owners who have also owned a C-Max or Fusion Energi?

I have an ionic silver Giga REX on order, but am still trying to complete my buying decision. I've been driving a Ford C-Max Energi for 16 months and 30K miles. I've driven the i3 and studied its specifications and features in person and online for a couple of months now, comparing it to my C-Max and trying to justify my decision to change. The C-Max is a great car, only slightly larger than the i3, but there are a few obvious differences, the biggest of which is range. The C-Max is a PHEV with about a 20 mile EV range and 500+ mile total range. My daily commute, with running errands, is about 25-30 miles, so the i3 looks very appealing as far as EV range is concerned. I know that the i3 is more of a "city car" than the C-Max, though, and doesn't have any where near the total range of the i3. I will have to adjust to using a different car for my longer trips (or making frequent gas stops). I've ordered the i3 with all of the tech options, as my C-Max is also fully-equipped with parking assistant and other gadgets.

I would be interested in hearing from any other C-Max or Fusion Energi owners that have made the switch to or addition of a BMW i3. What do you think of the i3 compared to the Energi?

Here are a few of my own comments:

• I will miss the "hands-free", automatic-opening rear hatch. You actually have to lift the hatch of the i3 to open it!
  The USA version of the i3 doesn't allow opening of the rear hatch from the key fob. I think that's a big mistake, especially since you can open the frunk with it.
  No AM radio in the i3! How will I get my sports talk shows and other sports?
  The C-Max has many "real" buttons and controls for various power train, entertainment and climate controls. The i3 relies on iDrive for most everything, with the option of assigning some controls to a few buttons on the dash. I think I like the real buttons better.
  The C-Max has a 120VAC power port that I use often.
  The C-Max hybrid range is obviously better than the i3.
  The i3 key fob is too big!
  The i3 has fixed rear passenger windows.
  The i3 A/C does not have vents for the rear passengers.
  The i3 seems roomier on the inside than the C-Max, certainly in the rear cargo area.
  The i3 EV range is obviously better than the C-Max.
  The i3 has a better warranty.
  The i3 has much better acceleration.
  The i3 is slightly more efficient.
  The i3 has Active Cruise Control, the C-Max does not.
  The i3 has DC quick charging (although no charge stations are available around here).

And, finally, the i3 is a lot more expensive than the C-Max.

Can anyone add to this list from personal experience? Will I be happier with the i3 than I am with the C-Max?

Thanks,
-RRi3

If cost to purchase is an issue then you don't buy.

If you think it is worth it for the driving experience then buy.

Don't compare to cheaper car try comparing to a similar cost car.

That would be my take on it.

I am buying as it is the only car in years when test drive made me think wow I want one

If I made decision purely on finance then I would never be able to buy one.

uktechie said:

If cost to purchase is an issue then you don't buy.

Click to expand...

No, I'm certainly not making my purchase decision based entirely on the cost. That's the purpose of trying to accumulate a list of positives and negatives for both vehicles, with all of them taken into consideration. And, although I didn't list it, the "Wow!" factor is under consideration, as well! The C-Max has it's own Wow factor, but the i3 is ahead by a couple of points.

-RR

Not sure, but I heard you can get AM radio stations on the FM band. Can anyone confirm this?

The i3 is an ultimate driving machine. The C-Max is not.

There will be many DC fast charging stations in the near future. So the i3 will be able to leave the city soon without gasoline.

Lola said:

Not sure, but I heard you can get AM radio stations on the FM band. Can anyone confirm this?

The i3 is an ultimate driving machine. The C-Max is not.

There will be many DC fast charging stations in the near future. So the i3 will be able to leave the city soon without gasoline.

Click to expand...

No, you cannot get AM stations on an FM radio. Technically impossible as the frequencies and modulations are different and incompatible. There may, however, be some simulcast stations playing the same thing on an AM station and an FM station.

Ultimate Driving Machine is marketing hype. Suggesting the hype makes the i3 superior is no better than claiming the i3 is unreliable because only at Ford will you find "Quality is Job 1" and BMW is not. I drove and very much liked the C-Max, but much preferred (and bought) the i3. It wasn't the marketing hype that sold me.

I won't need DC charging for my i3 BEV to leave the city (so long as I don't leave it by much!). In any case, the C-Max will always be an easier road car due to it's excellent performance and range on the available-everywhere gasoline. I don't recommend the i3 as an only car, unless trips of 100s of miles will be rare. I would have no problem using the C-Max for a city and touring car.

I am buying as it is the only car in years when test drive made me think wow I want one


SNAP!

i3Alan said:

Lola said:

Not sure, but I heard you can get AM radio stations on the FM band. Can anyone confirm this?

The i3 is an ultimate driving machine. The C-Max is not.

There will be many DC fast charging stations in the near future. So the i3 will be able to leave the city soon without gasoline.

Click to expand...

No, you cannot get AM stations on an FM radio. Technically impossible as the frequencies and modulations are different and incompatible. There may, however, be some simulcast stations playing the same thing on an AM station and an FM station.

Ultimate Driving Machine is marketing hype. Suggesting the hype makes the i3 superior is no better than claiming the i3 is unreliable because only at Ford will you find "Quality is Job 1" and BMW is not. I drove and very much liked the C-Max, but much preferred (and bought) the i3. It wasn't the marketing hype that sold me.

I won't need DC charging for my i3 BEV to leave the city (so long as I don't leave it by much!). In any case, the C-Max will always be an easier road car due to it's excellent performance and range on the available-everywhere gasoline. I don't recommend the i3 as an only car, unless trips of 100s of miles will be rare. I would have no problem using the C-Max for a city and touring car.

Click to expand...

I think he was referring to listening to AM on an FM channel. You can do that if you have HD Radio and there is an HD station that is in range offering an AM station on one of its secondary channels. HD Radio stations broadcast a digital signal over traditional radio frequencies allowing for up to three additional stations of new local content.

Does the i3 have an HD Radio receiver included? I'm guessing not

Zzzoom3 said:

I think he was referring to listening to AM on an FM channel. You can do that if you have HD Radio and there is an HD station that is in range offering an AM station on one of its secondary channels. HD Radio stations broadcast a digital signal over traditional radio frequencies allowing for up to three additional stations of new local content.

Does the i3 have an HD Radio receiver included? I'm guessing not

Click to expand...

Replaying an AM station on a FM HD side channel is a type of simulcast. The i3 does have an HD radio, at least in the Giga and Tera worlds.

my wife has the C-Max Energi. I prefer the i3 cargo space when folding the seats is better, due to the construction of the i3 AM radio reception is an issue and as stated they have HD and Sirius which comes with a 12 month free subscription. I get to charge at both ends and negate the use of gas even though I have the REX if needed. its a fun innovative car, which is ultimately why your paying more.
Driving modes on the i3 is a real world button allowing to toggle between Comfort, Eco Pro and Eco Pro +.
Nav and mapping is better if you got the premium package, the remote app is awesome, remotely lock and pre condition, also find your car , program charging times etc.
Split screen on the nav is a great feature and very customizable. It locates nearby chargers and shows their availability. Real time traffic and detailed info on accidents lanes closures when in route mode.

Stuart

Greatwhite said:

my wife has the C-Max Energi. I prefer the i3 cargo space when folding the seats is better, due to the construction of the i3 AM radio reception is an issue and as stated they have HD and Sirius which comes with a 12 month free subscription. I get to charge at both ends and negate the use of gas even though I have the REX if needed. its a fun innovative car, which is ultimately why your paying more.
Driving modes on the i3 is a real world button allowing to toggle between Comfort, Eco Pro and Eco Pro +.
Nav and mapping is better if you got the premium package, the remote app is awesome, remotely lock and pre condition, also find your car , program charging times etc.
Split screen on the nav is a great feature and very customizable. It locates nearby chargers and shows their availability. Real time traffic and detailed info on accidents lanes closures when in route mode.

Stuart

Click to expand...

Stuart, thanks for your reply. It's good to hear from someone who has experience with both cars.

I think I can do without AM radio, but I will be looking for streaming apps that will allow me to hear those stations online. I would also just carry a portable AM/FM radio and plug it into the AUX port.

I agree that Nav and mapping is probably better in the i3, from what I've seen in my test drives. How is the map data updated in the i3? Do you have to buy a new map database every year or two like you do with Ford?

I'm a little worried about the remote app for the i3. From what I've read, it is really limited compared to the C-Max. For example:
1. Can't unlock the doors with the i3 app. I can with Ford's. This is important if I forgot my key fob and just want to get something out of the car.
2. The Ford system provides text message and/or email updates on any changes in the status of the car, like charge complete, car alarm going off, etc. The i3 does not?
3. The Ford app shows me the exact location of the car at all times on a map. Does the i3 app do this, or does it just give directions to get to the car, as I've heard? That wouldn't be very helpful.
4. The Ford and i3 apps are similar, as far as I can tell, in how they setup preconditioning and start times.

I also think that the split-screen capability of the i3 display is great.

I do like the way that Ford puts so much information right in front of the driver, probably more than the i3 (various trip computers, battery and charging status, brake score, driving scores, etc, all customizable). The driver display in the i3 seems to be somewhat lacking in these areas, and you have to go to the main display to get some of the information.

I like that Ford displays the brake score all the time (a graphic that shows how efficiently the driver is braking and recovering energy into the battery). I wish that the i3 had this. It has really made a difference in how I drive (I typically get close to a 90% brake score!).

I think I might like the iDrive's console controls better than the Ford's touch screen. It's less distracting than having to look carefully at the screen in order to visually target buttons and controls for touch.

Can you comment on these questions and assumptions?

Except for these concerns, I think the i3 will be a great fit.

Thanks,
-RR

The i3 app can do four things remotely:
- lock/unlock
- flash lights
- honk horn
- precondition

Then, it has various things it can report (and I'll probably miss some):
- current battery SOC
- whether it is plugged in
- percent charge
- status on last trip
- current total miles
- estimated max range
- status on: doors, windows, and a few other things I don't remember right now!

I owned a Fusion Energi (and a Volt before that). At a fundamental level, the Fusion/CMAX Energi are closer in spirit to the Plugin Prius than the i3. The Fords are not really "eclectic cars," as the all-electric mode is PAINFULLY underpowered and has NONE of the torque/zip/fun of the i3. And they are heavy boats that don't handle well. It's a TOTALLY different driving experience. In this respect, the cars aren't even comparable as they are in totally different classes.

Even the Volt (which shares the long range capabilities of the Energi cars) has a fully useful all-electric mode.

Not knocking the Fords. It is AMAZING that you can get >40MPG for a full-size/decent power car. They are good at what they are--- and AWESOME deals were available when I got mine, so a much cheaper alternative.

Thanks, jadnashuanh and chrisn, for your insights.

I've had 3 test drives of the i3, and loved it, but it seems difficult to find out anything about the remote app until one actually has it.

Is it true that there is no web site that allows drivers/owners to access the same information as the app?

Also, do the Android and iOS apps provide the same features and functionality?

Thanks,
-RR

As of right now, there is no web-based way to get to the information, only if you download and install the app for your android or ios unit (I have it on an Android tablet). There is one more item you can monitor with the app I left off: whether the trunk is open/closed.

I've not used the ios app, so I do not know if it is as close to identical as they could be - there could be differences in what's available...just never tried it.

RR3, I haven't owned either the C-Max or the Fusion Energi, but here are my thoughts relative to your comments:

>I will miss the "hands-free", automatic-opening rear hatch. You actually have to lift the hatch of the i3 to open it!
>The USA version of the i3 doesn't allow opening of the rear hatch from the key fob. I think that's a big mistake, especially since you can open the frunk with it
Though the C-Max has a hands-free opening hatch, the smart remote keyless allows you to simply open the hatch without even pushing a button on the fob, and that's the same with the unlocking/locking the main doors.

>No AM radio in the i3! How will I get my sports talk shows and other sports?
Others have commented about the HD Radio's ability to selectively broadcast some of the AM stations on secondary (HD2, HD3, etc.) channels. For example, I saw in my local market KABC (790 AM) on one of my HD Radio stations. Also, I would use either the "Web Radio" functionality as part of the tech package or TuneIn Radio, which is one of the integrated apps for AM listening.

>The C-Max has many "real" buttons and controls for various power train, entertainment and climate controls. The i3 relies on iDrive for most everything, with the option of assigning some controls to a few buttons on the dash. I think I like the real buttons better.
I'm not sure if I agree. Climate controls are real buttons on the dash, as are the basic entertainment controls, plus some real buttons as part of the iDrive button cluster. I'm not sure what power train controls you're referring or comparing to on the dash. Being new to BMW, once I got the hang of iDrive, I've come to like its ability to execute commands with less distraction.

>The C-Max has a 120VAC power port that I use often.
That's a handy feature; I wish more cars in general would have that. However, most accessories rely on the the 12V ports, which you're already aware of.

>The C-Max hybrid range is obviously better than the i3.
Agreed. It's one of my peeves with the i3-REx, particularly since they downsized the tank for ZEV credit benefit.

>The i3 key fob is too big!
Yes, but it is flatter. ;-)

>The i3 has fixed rear passenger windows.
>The i3 A/C does not have vents for the rear passengers.
Agreed on both.

>The i3 seems roomier on the inside than the C-Max, certainly in the rear cargo area.
Totally agree. One of my issues with all three Ford plug-in vehicles are their oddly-shaped and impractical cargo areas.

>The i3 EV range is obviously better than the C-Max.
Yep--one of my reasons for choosing it over the Volt as well.

>The i3 has a better warranty.
No argument there.

>The i3 has much better acceleration.
Better than the Volt as well (though the Volt is respectable).
>The i3 is slightly more efficient.
I'm not sure what type of efficiency you're referring to here.

The i3 has Active Cruise Control, the C-Max does not.
> The Adaptive Cruise Control is a nice enhancement over the standard one.

>The i3 has DC quick charging (although no charge stations are available around here).
This is another reason why I chose the i3-REx over getting another Volt. Admittedly, it will take a year or so to get a decent number of SAE Combo QC chargers out there, but the car is built with the future in mind.

There are other features I could point out, but another big one for me is that the i3/i3-REx have a larger onboard charger (7.2 kW), even though we're currently hobbled in the 5.0-5.8 kW range for the moment. That still beats a 3.3 kW onboard charger of a C-Max or Volt. Given that I do a lot of opportunity public charging, this is a big advantage.

>And, finally, the i3 is a lot more expensive than the C-Max.>
Cost is an important consideration, but for me paying the extra over another Volt (relative to to its advancement over the last 4 model years) was a good value proposition.

>Can anyone add to this list from personal experience? Will I be happier with the i3 than I am with the C-Max?
It all depends on what factors make you happy. If you lean more to the practical, cost-savings side, perhaps a C-Max is right for you. However, the i3 might resonate emotionally with you, and it comes with a lot of superior EV and tech features that make it a very enjoyable driving experience. Perhaps you'll find the Volt to be a good middle-ground approach.

Bonus feature I really love--I can hold down the "talk" button on the steering wheel and I'll have near-instant access to Siri voice commands. With the Volt, I had to issue three successive audible commands ("Hands free," "Bluetooth," and "Voice"), and then finally it would let me talk to Siri.

HTH,
David