Help !!! I am down to Three Choices.I3 REX; Volt, MB-B

[electricvirgin]

I was thinking of the fact that the Volt has the ice engine charge the battery and drive the wheels, where the i3 only charges the battery.

 

[ultraturtle]

I was thinking of the fact that the Volt has the ice engine charge the battery and drive the wheels, where the i3 only charges the battery.

That's actually an advantage for the i3. As a pure series hybrid, full horsepower is always available from electric power alone, and the gasoline engine is never needed for maximum acceleration. The light weight of the small ICE contributes to the i3 REx not only accelerating 17% more quickly to 60 mph than the Volt, but getting 19% better electricity consumption per mile, and 5% better gasoline consumption per mile.

 

[jadnashuanh]

I would not consider the i3 with REx as an ICE replacement, since the max range and the fuel tank size are limited. The REx cannot produce enough juice to power everything at the max, so while you may never need it, it could be a problem especially if you lived in hilly areas or needed to do a lot of longer, high-speed travel in the cold. If you need that sort of longer trip capability, something like the Volt or a conventional ICE are, I think, your better choices. Only if you can regularly keep your daily driving within the electric range of the vehicle, is it a good choice. For most people, you'd have a choice, but I do not fit in the Volt, so it is out as a choice. The MB will not be sold in my state for what may be several years, so it was not on my radar screen. It would be more useful on the REx to be able to select when you wanted the engine to come on, rather than the way it was implemented for the USA to satisfy certain regional restrictions.

I'm planning to purchase a BEV i3 soon...just waiting on a couple of things to clear up first. I'll also keep my ICE for those longer drives where the i3 won't cut it. My normal daily driving is easily within range of the BEV.

 

[toolworker]

I got real tired of managing the 11 mile EV range on my Plug-in Prius, and was going to get an i3. But for a number of reasons I got sidetracked by the Volt and bought one three months ago.

I'm getting an honest 45 - 48 miles per charge, with a combination of local driving, some hills, and a fair amount of freeway.

Having test driven a couple of i3's, I concede that it's more fun than the Volt, and the gadgets are better, but it's closer than you might think. I'm impressed by the Volt's information displays and its handling. It gives the driver a number of options - sport vs. normal driving mode, two modes that turn on the ICE if desired, and two accelerator mappings, L with a fair amount of regen braking on the accelerator, maybe 2/3 of what the i3 does, and D with regen only on the brake pedal.

I don't use the ICE modes, so for me the Volt is a pure electric car with range extender engine (that I haven't needed yet). Even with low battery and the ICE on, it only couples to the drive wheels at speeds over 70 mph, so it is 99% a range extender.

GM took great pains to manage the battery. Posters on the Volt forums report tens of thousands of EV miles with no battery degradation. If a battery did have to be replaced, GM's exchange price is around $3000.

I thought the Volt would be a placeholder car, while I waited 6 months to 2 years to see how the i3 worked out and what else came on the market. But surprise - I'm really enjoying it. Even up, I might still take the i3, but it's hard to justify given the price difference, not just in MSRP but more so in the deal you'd wind up with.

 

[Recycledoug]

Sorry that it has taken me so long to get back to the forum... After much thinking... Perhaps too much thinking I went with a Nissan Leaf of all things.. It came down to one thing... I have never owned or leased an EV before... Nissan was discounting the 2014 Leaf's in the Midwest by almost $7,000 along with a 72 month 0% and "0" down loan, if you qualified... Add the $7500 Federal tax rebate and the Leaf is well under $20,000.... The Leaf has been out since 2010-2011 so the major bugs including battery heating issues have been resolved... So i am going to play around with an inexpensive Leaf for a few years... By that time I will be looking at the new options including perhaps a Volt with twice the EV range.

My major concern with the I3 was hearing firmware issues in the US market... Other markets do not have this issue... I owned a first year BMW about 8 years ago.... BMW was outstanding at fixing the issues and even picking the car up at my home.... However this went on and on...

The price of the !3, locally, with the Giga World is about $48,000 before taxes but after a dealer discount of about $1000. Our other BMW dealer is not discounting at all... It did not bother me to spend the $$$ given the technology in the B3... However I did not want to be soured by having issues with the vehicle... I am the type of person (ADD) that if my vehicle has ongoing issues I am quick to turn it over... I buy new cars just so I do not need to visit my dealer except for an oil change and tire rotation....

I decided I wanted total electric... I own 3 other cars so why worry about long trips in my EV.... I did a spreadsheet of all my driving during the week using a 80 mile range or a 40 mile tether... I assumed that I would charge at 220/30 amps at home and 110/15 amps at work.... After a week of driving.... consuming electrons and charging electrons at my two tether points, I never got below a 40 mile remaining range... So I feel comfortable with the total EV vehicle.... And i will probably put a 220 EVSE at work... Which will make the numbers look even better...

Thank you for all your comments... David, you were a big help... I felt the Volt was absolutely the way for me to go if I wanted the REX.... And in doing my spreadsheet calculations with the Volt I ended up only spending $1.80 on fuel all week.... I think the next generation Volt will be a game changer in 2016.... Given that the Volt is rated #1 for customer satisfaction of ALL vehicles sold.... It says a lot for the Volt !!!

And by the way the MB B can be ordered in my area, but I understand that it will take months to receive one.... And I am not sure I want to be the only B in town....

Doug

 

[i3nutter]

Here`s where we get lost. i3 has been designed to fulfill a certain function, just like a 5 series or X5. Can one compare it with a Tesla?
My take on the Volt, LEAF vs i3 was very simple really. I could have a BMW with the latest in technology and furthermore, a car that was designed from the ground up to be as exciting as one would suspect from BMW.
Both the LEAF and the VOLT is just OK. Very heavy cars that does not excite.

 

[davidrshelton]

Recycledoug, thanks for the update on your final decision. One of the first things I ask potential new EV buyers is to determine if a PHEV or a pure BEV is the more appropriate plug-in vehicle for their needs. What usually follows is a discussion about long-range driving needs and whether or not they'll be satisfied through a separate long-range vehicle. I should put in a caveat that if the person is well-heeled, I'll mention the Tesla option so that they can have a long-range pure EV option.

In the "good 'ole days" of EV ownership, there was only a BEV choice, so many owners ended up having a "primary" long-range ICE vehicle as insurance for the occasional (or not-so-occasional) long-distance trip, and then the "secondary" EV that one would end up using 99% of the time for shorter trips. I myself fell into this category, as we had a '96 Audi A4 that sat in the garage and only was driven once every few months (few hundred miles per year), and a Toyota RAV4 EV that we would drive 99% of the time (9K miles per year). We would actually drive to LA with it, finding a reliable place to plug in up there and then driving back; it was about 120 miles round trip.

Nowadays, there are thankfully more choices. Had I known that you already have ICE vehicles for distance, I would say that taking the pure EV plunge would make sense. And if one were to ask me, I would say the LEAF has become the BEV standard bearer for those looking for an economical EV with reasonable range that has the support of the OEM.

In your case, I hope you got the LEAF with one of the higher trim lines. As you might be aware, the low-end model has the smaller 3.3kW on-board charger, whereas the higher models have the 6.6kW charger. I just met a fellow employee who bought a base-trim LEAF (his second one) but didn't realize why he was charging more slowly at Level 2 stations with his new vehicle. However for you, if charging time is not of the essence, then the 3.3kW charger might be just fine.

Best of luck with your LEAF.

Enjoy the ride,
David

 

[davidrshelton]

Here`s where we get lost. i3 has been designed to fulfill a certain function, just like a 5 series or X5. Can one compare it with a Tesla?
My take on the Volt, LEAF vs i3 was very simple really. I could have a BMW with the latest in technology and furthermore, a car that was designed from the ground up to be as exciting as one would suspect from BMW.
Both the LEAF and the VOLT is just OK. Very heavy cars that does not excite.

Your comments about the emotional aspects of car ownership are well taken, and BMW plays this card well. I can assure you there was a similar amount of excitement over the Volt from the early concept car prototypes to the eventual release in Fall 2010. The LEAF took a slightly different path with its release but also generated a great deal of interest, something that continues to this day.

I actually agree with you that the i3 represents an advancement of the PHEV paradigm in an exciting package. Today's Volt still is at Version 1.1 or 1.2, and I know I'll need to wait awhile until we get to "Volt 2.0." The same can be said for the LEAF, also at a Version 1.1 or 1.2. That was ultimately the reason why I chose to go with the i3-REx.

No matter what anyone says about it, the Volt and LEAF are still the top sellers in their respective class. How long they keep this up depends on their ability to make advancements to keep future buyers interested.

David

 

[Recycledoug]

I have to agree with you that the I3 brings to the table what only BMW can do.... Driving excitement. When one begins to examine the details of the I3 it becomes an engineering marvel. To look even at the seat design it's amazing. The design and implementation of the IP is stellar... Never done before... And removing so much weight from the vehicle truly establishes a new bar for all mfgs to beat. Folks think that Ford's removal of 700 pounds from a Ford F150 is incredible in the new 2015 truck... But the F150 is a 5,000 + lb. vehicle and was 300 lbs. heavier than the competition. . BMW took what is typically a 3,700 pound vehicle and took 800 pounds off the vehicle.

So to me, the I3 is worth every penny of the purchase price. The I3 really rocks!!! But when I decided to see if I liked flying many years ago I did not opt for a latest and greatest plane. Instead I bought something to test the water.... An established model built over many years. And especially in planes one does not want to be the test pilot... And so be it with me and an I3....