Advice from current i3 owners who owned a Nissan Leaf

[epirali]

Hi there:

Sorry if this is redundant but I could not get the search to work no matter how hard I tried!

I am considering switching from my Leaf to the i3 w/Rex. I am very familiar with the strength/weaknesses of BEVs, Rex, etc (currently own three electric cars). The question I have for people who have owned both is this:

Ignoring the economics of the two what is your experience of the i3 after the Leaf. Is the i3 really that much more comfortable, or has better ride/drive?

Keep in mind I am not looking to the i3 to be any kind of "performer," mainly would be switching for the Rex and improvement in the daily driving experience.

Thanks in advance.

 

[Schnort]

I only test drove the leaf, and I know you say you're not interested in it to be any kind of "performer", but it is. At least the BEV is a fun, zippy, car to drive that you don't have to worry about merging or passing in. My experience with the LEAF was it felt strong right off the line, but quickly died. The i3 still has some punch at 60.

 

[epirali]

I only test drove the leaf, and I know you say you're not interested in it to be any kind of "performer", but it is. At least the BEV is a fun, zippy, car to drive that you don't have to worry about merging or passing in. My experience with the LEAF was it felt strong right off the line, but quickly died. The i3 still has some punch at 60.

Thanks that is what I gather from reviews. I am using the leaf as relaxed commuter car so that's the comparison. For zippy I just grab the roadster!

 

[BrianStanier]

After three years with the Leaf we find the i3Rex to have a much harsher ride and so less comfortable on the country roads it spends most of its time on. Of course the i3 is quicker, better built and more fun to drive, but if comfort and value for moneys were the only criteria the Leaf wins every time.

However the Leaf is limiting for us wanting to use it on the Yorkshire dales and moors where charging facilities are almost non-existent. So we now have the Rex.

 

[epirali]

After three years with the Leaf we find the i3Rex to have a much harsher ride and so less comfortable on the country roads it spends most of its time on. Of course the i3 is quicker, better built and more fun to drive, but if comfort and value for moneys were the only criteria the Leaf wins every time.

However the Leaf is limiting for us wanting to use it on the Yorkshire dales and moors where charging facilities are almost non-existent. So we now have the Rex.

Thank you that is very helpful. It is what I fear, trading the benefit of the Rex and better build for ride quality.

 

[MGS9500]

I owned a Leaf for a two year lease. I now have the i3.

The leaf is a very capable car. However, the ride is like a soft and large luxury car. Nice on the bumps but no feel. I had it for two years and nothing ever went wrong.

The BMW rides more like a sports car. I own a mini cooper, and I love driving it because it gives me a sports car feel The i3 gives the same sensation. It is absolutely a more rigid ride, but if you like a sporty ride, it's for you. And, as an electric, you never really are in it for six hours straight.

For me, commuting every day, I never feel it is uncomfortable.

And, my i3 is loaded with every option. I love the sensors, the driver assist package, the warning sensors and the cruise control that adjusts for the car ahead of you.

On a technology point of view, the i3 is the winner.

From a comfort point of view, the Leaf is softer.

From a transport point of view, they both get you there.

 

[epirali]

I owned a Leaf for a two year lease. I now have the i3.

The leaf is a very capable car. However, the ride is like a soft and large luxury car. Nice on the bumps but no feel. I had it for two years and nothing ever went wrong.

The BMW rides more like a sports car. I own a mini cooper, and I love driving it because it gives me a sports car feel The i3 gives the same sensation. It is absolutely a more rigid ride, but if you like a sporty ride, it's for you. And, as an electric, you never really are in it for six hours straight.

For me, commuting every day, I never feel it is uncomfortable.

And, my i3 is loaded with every option. I love the sensors, the driver assist package, the warning sensors and the cruise control that adjusts for the car ahead of you.

On a technology point of view, the i3 is the winner.

From a comfort point of view, the Leaf is softer.

From a transport point of view, they both get you there.

Thank you for that. Every car I own besides the leaf range from sporty to painful in ride. I like that for sports car but Leaf/i3 would both be for commuting/comfort.

I do like the extra tech in i3 but it's not enough to tip me over for an extra $20k. I assume it gets similar electric only range?

Anything else that stands out?

 

[jadnashuanh]

The i3 has optional 20" wheels with summer performance tires. When you choose that option, you pay for it in ride comfort. It's not a huge difference, but it is definitely there. Plus, if you live where it gets cold and/or snowy, you'd then need to buy another set of wheels/tires for the winter, as the summer performance tires are not adequate, at least when the going gets tough. I think the area behind the seats on the i3 is maybe more useful...the deep well in the back of the leaf may be useful for shopping bags, but the shape leaves something to be desired for other stuff. I have a folding recumbent trike...it fits fine in the i3, but would not fit in the Leaf, for example. I think the i3 is easier to get in and out of as well. Has a larger on-board charging circuit, so can recharge faster, and on the 2015 models, the DC fast charging is standard. Now, that doesn't mean you'll find any places to use it! The BEV will get about the same mileage as the Leaf, the REx, because of the extra weight you're carrying around all of the time can't on EV mode, but then throw in the REx, and you can go much further if you're willing to stop every hour or so to refill the fuel tank. The BEV in the USA comes standard with the heat pump for heating while the REx cannot have that as the location of the heat pump is taken up by the gas tank. So, you lose mileage in the cold because heating is a 1:1 thing, verses the heat pump's 3-4:1 advantage. Small things, but noticeable. If you read the forum, you'll find many people only use the REx to check that it actually works, and run normally without it. IMHO, if you need the REx, the i3 may not be the best choice of vehicle. But if it must be an only car, it does give you the capacity to take it on longer trips. Personally, I find my ICE more comfortable and useful on those than the i3 would ever be, but that's me.

 

[epirali]

The i3 has optional 20" wheels with summer performance tires. When you choose that option, you pay for it in ride comfort. It's not a huge difference, but it is definitely there. Plus, if you live where it gets cold and/or snowy, you'd then need to buy another set of wheels/tires for the winter, as the summer performance tires are not adequate, at least when the going gets tough. I think the area behind the seats on the i3 is maybe more useful...the deep well in the back of the leaf may be useful for shopping bags, but the shape leaves something to be desired for other stuff. I have a folding recumbent trike...it fits fine in the i3, but would not fit in the Leaf, for example. I think the i3 is easier to get in and out of as well. Has a larger on-board charging circuit, so can recharge faster, and on the 2015 models, the DC fast charging is standard. Now, that doesn't mean you'll find any places to use it! The BEV will get about the same mileage as the Leaf, the REx, because of the extra weight you're carrying around all of the time can't on EV mode, but then throw in the REx, and you can go much further if you're willing to stop every hour or so to refill the fuel tank. The BEV in the USA comes standard with the heat pump for heating while the REx cannot have that as the location of the heat pump is taken up by the gas tank. So, you lose mileage in the cold because heating is a 1:1 thing, verses the heat pump's 3-4:1 advantage. Small things, but noticeable. If you read the forum, you'll find many people only use the REx to check that it actually works, and run normally without it. IMHO, if you need the REx, the i3 may not be the best choice of vehicle. But if it must be an only car, it does give you the capacity to take it on longer trips. Personally, I find my ICE more comfortable and useful on those than the i3 would ever be, but that's me.

Thanks very good advice. Unfortunately main reason I am looking at i3 is the Rex. My wife can't use the leaf for certain trips due to range and the Rex will put them in range. But have a resistive heating in winter will kill range if it's anything like a leaf.

 

[BrianStanier]

The i3 Rex range drops in winter much like the Gen1 Leaf without the heat pump. But if your journeys are short, say up to 10 miles, preconditioning (even just the cabin) may be sufficient to avoid needing much extra heating during the trip. It depends on the outside temperature and what you consider comfortable. We find 18C perfectly OK, others seem to need much more.

 

[epirali]

The i3 Rex range drops in winter much like the Gen1 Leaf without the heat pump. But if your journeys are short, say up to 10 miles, preconditioning (even just the cabin) may be sufficient to avoid needing much extra heating during the trip. It depends on the outside temperature and what you consider comfortable. We find 18C perfectly OK, others seem to need much more.

I always precondition (for comfort and range), but I'm looking at the Rex by definition for range. I know I'm trading off maybe 10 miles in winter for gaining 70 miles from a tank but then I am guessing the i3 isn't smart enough to use the heat of the Rex instead of pumping the electricity into the resistive element.

Do you feel a further loss of power when on Rex and using the heat?

 

[alohart]

I know I'm trading off maybe 10 miles in winter for gaining 70 miles from a tank but then I am guessing the i3 isn't smart enough to use the heat of the Rex instead of pumping the electricity into the resistive element.

The REx engine's waste heat isn't used to heat the i3 cabin. The plumbing required might not be worth the heat recovered from the small REx engine.

Do you feel a further loss of power when on Rex and using the heat?

Heating the cabin while running the REx shouldn't cause a loss of power, but it does cause the same loss of energy with or without the REx running.

 

[epirali]

I know I'm trading off maybe 10 miles in winter for gaining 70 miles from a tank but then I am guessing the i3 isn't smart enough to use the heat of the Rex instead of pumping the electricity into the resistive element.

The REx engine's waste heat isn't used to heat the i3 cabin. The plumbing required might not be worth the heat recovered from the small REx engine.

Do you feel a further loss of power when on Rex and using the heat?

Heating the cabin while running the REx shouldn't cause a loss of power, but it does cause the same loss of energy with or without the REx running.

From what I've read without ability to hold SOC the battery depletes too much before Rex kicks in. If this is the case the load from heating surely must impact power available from the Rex generator. I have seen reports of Rex having issues keeping up in high load (like climbing) when battery is too low.

 

[alohart]

From what I've read without ability to hold SOC the battery depletes too much before Rex kicks in.

The REx starts automatically at ~6.5% SOC. No power loss would occur until the SOC drops below 1.9% regardless of whether the heater is on (see BMW's chart in this article). Running the heater could cause the SOC to drop faster unless the REx generator's output is sufficient to maintain the battery pack's SOC which it would be if one's speed isn't too high or a steep hill isn't being ascended. But even temporary drops in the battery pack's SOC don't result in power loss unless the SOC drops below 1.9%.

If this is the case the load from heating surely must impact power available from the Rex generator. I have seen reports of Rex having issues keeping up in high load (like climbing) when battery is too low.

The REx generator charges the battery pack only, so running the heater has no impact on the power produced by the REx generator. However, if the power required by the traction motor, heater, 12 v. battery, etc., exceeds the power output of the REx generator, the battery pack's SOC will start to drop. No power loss would occur until the SOC drops below 1.9%.

Power loss in a REx i3 is manageable. It isn't something that occurs suddenly without warning unless the driver isn't paying attention to the battery pack's SOC. But SOC management while the REx is running might require a change in speed, heater setting, etc.

 

[epirali]

From what I've read without ability to hold SOC the battery depletes too much before Rex kicks in.

The REx starts automatically at ~6.5% SOC. No power loss would occur until the SOC drops below 1.9% regardless of whether the heater is on (see BMW's chart in this article). Running the heater could cause the SOC to drop faster unless the REx generator's output is sufficient to maintain the battery pack's SOC which it would be if one's speed isn't too high or a steep hill isn't being ascended. But even temporary drops in the battery pack's SOC don't result in power loss unless the SOC drops below 1.9%.

If this is the case the load from heating surely must impact power available from the Rex generator. I have seen reports of Rex having issues keeping up in high load (like climbing) when battery is too low.

The REx generator charges the battery pack only, so running the heater has no impact on the power produced by the REx generator. However, if the power required by the traction motor, heater, 12 v. battery, etc., exceeds the power output of the REx generator, the battery pack's SOC will start to drop. No power loss would occur until the SOC drops below 1.9%.

Power loss in a REx i3 is manageable. It isn't something that occurs suddenly without warning unless the driver isn't paying attention to the battery pack's SOC. But SOC management while the REx is running might require a change in speed, heater setting, etc.

Thanks that was what I was hinting at. Anyone have real life experience with this with two passengers and temperatures around 25-30 f?

 

[noodle]

I had a Gen1 Leaf for 3 years and just got an i3 Rex in May. I have two young children and drive a lot for work. I haven't experienced a winter with the i3 yet but found it a chore in the LEAF.

I absolutely adore the i3 and genuinely enjoy driving it in all conditions. I have the 19" alloys and the ride is a little more brittle than the LEAF but it's a small price to pay for the thrilling acceleration, suspension and handling. My kids and wife love it, all my friends and neighbours love how weird and "futuristic" it is and I can even transport my bike with it (using a seasucker rack). The Rex makes life significantly easier for me, making 120 mile trips with ease and in total comfort (driving with heating and high speed), I also opted for DC fast charging prep which makes re-charging at local CCS rapids a total breeze.

The big compromises for me (comparing the i3 to the LEAF) are:

- Only able to carry 3 passengers (as opposed to the LEAF's 4)
- Boot space is significantly less than the LEAF
- CCS chargers are less prolific than Chademo (the LEAF's rapid) at the mo
- BMW options list is pricey (LEAF's are much cheaper to spec up)
- I'm probably going to use A LOT of rear tyres

Overall I would say, the i3 is a fantastic car to own and drive. Its fun, practical and highly unusual. If you have ready access to charging infrastructure and aren't hammering out huge motorway miles every week it's a fantastic all-rounder. Good luck!

 

[epirali]

I had a Gen1 Leaf for 3 years and just got an i3 Rex in May. I have two young children and drive a lot for work. I haven't experienced a winter with the i3 yet but found it a chore in the LEAF.

I absolutely adore the i3 and genuinely enjoy driving it in all conditions. I have the 19" alloys and the ride is a little more brittle than the LEAF but it's a small price to pay for the thrilling acceleration, suspension and handling. My kids and wife love it, all my friends and neighbours love how weird and "futuristic" it is and I can even transport my bike with it (using a seasucker rack). The Rex makes life significantly easier for me, making 120 mile trips with ease and in total comfort (driving with heating and high speed), I also opted for DC fast charging prep which makes re-charging at local CCS rapids a total breeze.

The big compromises for me (comparing the i3 to the LEAF) are:

- Only able to carry 3 passengers (as opposed to the LEAF's 4)
- Boot space is significantly less than the LEAF
- CCS chargers are less prolific than Chademo (the LEAF's rapid) at the mo
- BMW options list is pricey (LEAF's are much cheaper to spec up)
- I'm probably going to use A LOT of rear tyres

Overall I would say, the i3 is a fantastic car to own and drive. Its fun, practical and highly unusual. If you have ready access to charging infrastructure and aren't hammering out huge motorway miles every week it's a fantastic all-rounder. Good luck!

Thank you this is perfect feedback. I trying to pull the trigger but unfortunately running into typical BMW dealer syndrome...even from a dealer I bought an i8 from.

 

[704hov1451]

I owned a Leaf as an "early adopter" from 2011 until November 2014, when I switched to an i3 REX. The Leaf was comfortable and trouble-free. But the battery seemed to degrade quickly--the 65-70 mile range when new had become about 40 miles (at the usual 75-80 mph commuting speed here in the Orange County HOV lane), which gave me a daily case of Range Anxiety. No way I was going to put down $80-100K to drive a Tesla, so the REX was a godsend. Even with my high-speed commute (sometimes people in the HOV lane here push 90 mph), I always get 65+ miles on a charge, so I seldom have had to use the REX, and I have seen no battery degradation in 6 months. I think the battery is simply better, as is the whole car. Yes, you pay a whole lot more, but you get BMW quality and with the REX, that extra range that makes it work for most of us. This car rocks. And Nissan vs. BMW dealerships? No contest.

 

[planetf1]

Most has already been said. I too had a leaf for 3 years and moved to the i3 six weeks ago.

The "killer" feature for me was the rex. Though I had the leaf as my only car and did longer journeys (>250 in a day) it required more planning, care, plan a/b/c. In the rex I've already ventured into "sparse" zones, I've done more back-to-back in terms of time .. and yet only used 6l of fuel. But it's amazing how the hard "you will be stranded" is now a "bother, I really don't want to use fuel". I do have CCS

That aside the i3 is peppier, I prefer the interior, more gadgets (I went for all the driving aids). adaptive cruise in particular is great. The access to the rear is more awkward, though I don't have kids living with me. Audio is better (upgraded).

Driven gently the EV range is on a par, probably exceeded my mk1 when new. I can't comment on winter.

CCS is more sparse, but rather than stopping on motorways at 45-50 miles ( to allow for a plan B) I can stop at 60-70 miles, or even more.

That being said the leaf was a great very usable car.. and much cheaper. Had it not been for the rex I may not have indulged.... but I'm glad I did.

 

[epirali]

Thank you both I think I am exactly in the same boat. Love my Leaf (2013), no real degradation at 30k but really do want the bit more range. The toys are fun but the Rex is the deal maker. Now if I only could find a reasonable BMW dealer. The leaf took 10 minutes to buy, my local dealers almost gave me giving up on the idea.