Drivetrain issue - "Do not switch off engine"

[Jeremy]

RJSATLBA/MikeS

You are correct - I hadn't read my contract carefully enough

That explains why it isn't on dealer letterhead.

In a way that may be better - much bigger target and more reputation risk than a dealership, if things get confrontational.

The BMW iService No. (from my phone log - but I'm pretty sure) is 0800 777 111.

They are very pro-active and have your data cross referenced against reg. no.

No news for me this week so far.

 

[MikeS]

Jeremy - Thank you for the number. I think I would prefer a smaller target. At least with a dealer I can speak to the manager face to face!

Calibanjon - I hope all turns out to work perfectly now. Its a little worrying that the problem/solution appears so opaque. I think there must be a primary software version number somewhere and it would be useful if we could know what it was, but knowing other BMW cars it may be hard to find.

 

[Piekepuk]

Hi Guys, had the same message as SanSerif yesterday. It is a different message than I have had earlier twice, which was less stressing on the word 'soon' (aka 'weldra' in dutch). The message reappeared immediatly upon pressing 'START' for the return journey after dinner. We were also on a longer trip, also with REx on for some time. The message seems unconnected with the workings of the REx though.

I let the car send the diagnositic info to BMW (again). Even though the message didn't reappear this morning, I will be contacting BMW tomorrow to get it checked out. Guessworkdiagnosis: oil level in the diff or something ? Everything keeps functioning normal at this point, no over-temperature warnings or whatever.

Collected my REx this wednesday april 16th, and yes, today I got the drivetrain messages. After switching the car off and on, everything looks okay. I will keep you updated.

Bart.

 

[Stevei3]

Hi Bart,

After contacting BMW about our drivetrain-error message, I was told that, in our case (yours could be different, we didn't see the 'do not switch engine off' warning), it was no problem to continue driving our i3. I have made an appointment with them anyway so they can assess the issue. I guess it will result in a software update. I hope (and expect) that to resolve our issue. I guess (and hope) something like that will fix yours as well, for the software of the car seems to be the culprit most of the times...
That said, it's been a while since we had the last warning. We made a full-electric 353 km roundtrip yesterday on mixed roads (60% motorway), with two stops at FastNed (=50kW DC) without any messages popping up.

Regards and all the best, Steven

 

[Piekepuk]

Hi Bart,

After contacting BMW about our drivetrain-error message, I was assured that, in our case (yours could be different, we didn't see the 'do not switch engine off' warning), it was no problem to continue driving our i3. I have made an appointment with them anyway so they can assess the issue. I guess it will result in a software update. I hope (and expect) that to resolve our issue. I guess (and hope) something like that will fix yours as well, for the software of the car seems to be the culprit most of the times...
That said, it's been a while since we had the last warning. We made a full-electric 353 km roundtrip yesterday on mixed roads (60% motorway), with two stops at FastNed (=50kW DC) without any messages popping up.

Regards and all the best, Steven

Hello Steven,

Thanks for your reply.
I will keep track of the messages.
Today we had no problems, just the sheer pleasure of an electric drive.

Regards,

Bart

 

[RoboBMR]

I bought my i3 yesterday (5/26/14) & had a very NEGATIVE experience when the range extender took over. The cars performance maintained for an additional 15 to 20 minutes of freeway drive time & then the car suddenly dropped in speed very drastically. On level parts of the freeway I was able to maintain 65mph (barely). When the freeway started to incline, my speed dropped to 52mph. That was with ONLY me in the car (155lbs). Had I passengers or loaded something heavy in the back, that speed would have surely dropped to 40mph. A very scary situation to be in when the normal flow of traffic in California is 70 to 80mph. Someone could easily hit me from behind and kill me in that situation. I told BMW right away that I found that to be unacceptable and that I was promised the cars performance to maintain full horsepower regardless if it was battery power or the 2 cylinder engine powering the battery. The car is currently being serviced because the Drivetrain warning indicator came on along with the check engine light after owning the car for only 5 hours. I'm hoping these issues will get resolved. This is my 1st EV and it hasn't given me a good first impression at all.

 

[Gonville]

So the SOC must have been down to 6% ? For the REX to come on? So I guess driving at 80 probably would become an issue after 20 miles? Is that right?

How far did you drive?

 

[RJSATLBA]

It's a long time since I've been to the USA, the fact that there was a very tedious blanket limit of 55mph (even on long, straight, nearly empty roads) probably shows how long. But seriously, what is the speed limit on freeways in California, surely it isn't 80mph in a state that has so much legislation to reduce pollution from vehicles. If so it might be quite difficult to run an argument that the i3 is unacceptable if it can't maintain 70-80mph on the REx.

 

[Gonville]

Be a bit like "limp" mode in an ICE. When engine management goes to standby you can't do 80 that's for sure.

 

[Gonville]

....and on a space saver tyre I think you would be at 50mph max? So maybe we should view an EV in REX mode in the same light? You really are on standby backup? Not proceed as normal? With caution?

Interesting debate I think?

 

[RJSATLBA]

Interesting debate indeed but one which is fundamentally different between the US and Europe. I don't think one should regard the REx as limp mode nor as analagous to driving on a space saver spare in Europe when one can invoke the REx at 75/80% SOC (I forget which).

However in the US where the REx won't come on until around 5% SOC it seems pretty clear that if you continue to use anywhere near full electric power, you will be taking more out of the battery than the REx can put in and will soon reach a negligible SOC where the only power you have left is what the REx can produce ie 34 or 38 bhp depending whether or not the car has the later uprated REx engine.

If a salesman says you will always have full power he may be being misleading but may also be correct, after all we all know that full power on a 200bhp ICE is zero if the tank is empty! So full power with nothing left in the battery is 34/38bhp, which is some way short of full performance.

15-20 mins at 70-80mph sounds like the REx did a pretty good job of reducing the rate of battery depletion before there was nothing left but the power the REx could generate.

 

[RoboBMR]

The speed limit in California is 65mph. However, the average speed people drive here is 75 to 80mph. It's very typical driving behavior. I wish BMW told me the truth about what kind of performance to REALLY expect when it switches to the Range Extender. Had I known the Range Extender is strictly for getting me to the next charging station and not for long distance performance, I probably wouldn't have bought the car. BMW lied to me and said I could drive this car as much as I want with the Range Extender and still maintain full performance. Not true at all. Even though I like the car, I'm probably not the best candidate to own it because of how much daily driving I do. I think BMW did a fantastic job on style and performance (when charged), but now I see that this car is for someone who only drives 60 to 70 miles a day (at the most) unless they have access to a lot of charging stations wherever they go. On a positive note, I know that the infrastructure will continue to grow with more and more charging stations. Especially in the next 2 years. If I end up keeping the car, I hope I find enough charging stations around town (San Diego) so this becomes a non-issue. As of right now I'm very nervous to own a car that makes me feel I need to constantly focus on where I'm going to get it charged verses focusing on where I'm going and what I need to get done that day.

 

[buickanddeere]

Sounds like every EV needs a set of wrenches and a paperback novel. The wrenches to isolate all battery power from the vehicle. And the book to read for 20 minutes while waiting to make certain the electronics are powered down.
Re-connect the batteries and most phantom software faults will go away for at least a while.

 

[drb]

Experience trumps speculation in the matter of the REx's performance. I encourage you to read Tom's article on his blog, bmwi3blogspot.com, from this past Monday. Very insightful about the REx.

 

[Surge]

I bought my i3 yesterday (5/26/14) & had a very NEGATIVE experience when the range extender took over. The cars performance maintained for an additional 15 to 20 minutes of freeway drive time & then the car suddenly dropped in speed very drastically. On level parts of the freeway I was able to maintain 65mph (barely). When the freeway started to incline, my speed dropped to 52mph. That was with ONLY me in the car (155lbs). Had I passengers or loaded something heavy in the back, that speed would have surely dropped to 40mph. A very scary situation to be in when the normal flow of traffic in California is 70 to 80mph. Someone could easily hit me from behind and kill me in that situation. I told BMW right away that I found that to be unacceptable and that I was promised the cars performance to maintain full horsepower regardless if it was battery power or the 2 cylinder engine powering the battery. The car is currently being serviced because the Drivetrain warning indicator came on along with the check engine light after owning the car for only 5 hours. I'm hoping these issues will get resolved. This is my 1st EV and it hasn't given me a good first impression at all.

Please let us know if your REx is the newly upgraded higher horsepower version. Apparently it's a software upgrade; but it may not make a difference.
Anyway, let us know.

 

[RoboBMR]

Hi Surge,

I got my i3 back from the dealer yesterday and so far the Drivetrain warning light has not come back on. However, when the car switched to the engine to charge the battery today, it said "please recharge as quickly as possible or running the engine for a long period of time could damage the battery". Not a good design at all if you ask me. I really hate to say this but I'm regretting my purchase.

 

[Jeremy]

It always seemed crazy to me that the US REx doesn't cut in until the battery is almost flat.

From my very first demo experience - it was obvious that you need at least 20% battery back-up available for normal highway driving - including hills, overtaking etc.

On my first long motorway journey this week, I confirmed that the REx can hold battery charge state, on the level, at 73mph on cruise control. Over 75mph the battery starts to deplete - and in any case it can drop 10% quite quickly on a gradient or when increasing speed to pass a line of trucks etc.

This depletion can, of course, be recovered by reducing speed or on a downhill stretch - but it seems obvious to me that a 5% reserve will never be enough to maintain normal progress.

I think US customers have been oversold the car.

 

[noakey]

It always seemed crazy to me that the US REx doesn't cut in until the battery is almost flat.

From my very first demo experience - it was obvious that you need at least 20% battery back-up available for normal highway driving - including hills, overtaking etc.

On my first long motorway journey this week, I confirmed that the REx can hold battery charge state, on the level, at 73mph on cruise control. Over 75mph the battery starts to deplete - and in any case it can drop 10% quite quickly on a gradient or when increasing speed to pass a line of trucks etc.

This depletion can, of course, be recovered by reducing speed or on a downhill stretch - but it seems obvious to me that a 5% reserve will never be enough to maintain normal progress.

I think US customers have been oversold the car.

Sounds like US regulation is killing the rex in the US. In the UK you can activate it at any point on the journey providing state of charge is less than I think 80%. Please don't blame BMW or the i3 design. It must have been a huge task to produce this car to fit worldwide markets and all the separate regulations. I say well done bmw. awesome machine. now... back to my BEV.

 

[XXL]

This reminds me of 30 years back as a student, driving in a 600cc powered 2 cylinder vehicle, heavy rain, driving uphill a motorway, pedal to the metal but it didn't move. It was a 2CV.

At 5-6% SOC and when the REX can't keep up, performance is reduced instead of depleting (or even damaging) the battery. But in the US the REX only kicks in at very low % SOC and then this is almost a limp-home mode. Accidents will happen. This could have very bad impact on the BMW i3's reputation, like the burning Tesla's.

 

[MikeS]

Its true that the REX in the USA has some limitations, but it still offers a back up to the BEV.